General Notes

[Joanne's Tree.1 GED.GED]

2  SOUR S332582
3  DATA
4  TEXT Date of Import: 14 Jan 2004


[daveanthes.FTW]

Ramundus, surnamed le Gros, bur. in the Abbey of Morlana near unto Youghal, "after whose death the Carews that were issued from Odo had all his lands" (in co. Carlow) but Raymond's natural sons, Walter and Richard, succeeded to the lands in co. Cork which he had of Robert Fitz-Stephen.  Raymond's natural children were NOT Lord Fitzmorice of Kerry, the Baron of Brentchurch, the families of
Pendergast or the Graces.  The Carews of Cork and the Redmunds of Wexford, yes.  But, the rest is pure fiction.

Raymond le Gros married Priscilla, da of Gilbert de Clare, sister to Richard de Clare alias Strongbow, Earl of Pembroke, and died without legitimate issue. (Sir Thos. Phillipps and Berry call her Basilia).

We do not know all of the illegitimate children of Raymond le Gros, but we do know from some charters in the Chartulary of St. Mary's Abbey that he left two natural sons, Walter and Richard.  These charters concern Tilechstelan, a parish near Glencullen, co. Dublin, and by them William fitz Odo de Carew, Raymond's nephew and heir to his lands in co. Carlow, and 'Walterus filius Reimundi' confirm a former grant made before 1185 by Raymond (Chartulary, vol. i., pp. 1067-11, and cf. p. 86). Among these are three grants by 'Walterus filius Reimundi:'  the first (no. 89) was witnessed by Gerald fitz Maurice, who was dead by January 1204 (Cal. Docs. Ireland, vol. i., no. 195), and by Meiler fitz Henry, who is not called justiciar, therefore before 1199, and by another witness 'Richard de Carew'. By the second (no. 90) Walter grants and confirms the church of Tilechstelan with the land which his father Raymond had granted to it, and this is witnessed by 'Richard his brother'.  The third (no. 91) commences:  Sciant, &c., quod ego Walterus filius Reimundi commendavi cartas meas quas habeo de Comite [Strongbow] et de patre meo Reimundo in manu monachorum monasterii sancte Marie iuxla Dublin, &c. 'Recardus filius Reimundi' witnessed a grant by Basilia, Raymond's widow, in 1199-1200 (Reg. St. Thomas, p. 111). (see: Orpen, Ireland Under the Normans, pp.150-151)

According to Giraldus, Raymond inherited half the kingdom of Cork from his uncle, Robert fitz Stephen, who d.s.p. about 1183.  We know that Raymond was succeeded in Cork by his (illegitimate) son, Richard de Carew, 1st Lord of Cork, d. 1205 and was succeeded by his son,
Robert de Carew, 2nd Lord of Cork, d. 1245 and was succeeded by his son, Richard de Carew, 3rd Lord of Cork, d. 1272 and was succeeded by his son, Maurice de Carew, 4th Lord of Cork, d. 1319 and was succeeded by his son, Thomas de Carew, 5th Lord of Cork.  He d. 1399.

Tom Magness, Oct 8, 2001

Source: Tim Sandberg's GEDCOM V. Oct. 29, 2001
WARNING! THIS GENEALOGY IS, AND WILL REMAIN FOREVER, A WORK IN PROGRESS. THE AUTHOR IS NOT A PROFESSIONAL GENEALOGIST, BUT HAS TRIED TO VERIFY ALL DATA. IT CANNOT BE GUARANTEED FREE OF ERRORS!