General Notes

[Joanne's Tree.1 GED.GED]

2  SOUR S332582
3  DATA
4  TEXT Date of Import: 14 Jan 2004

ID: I14449
Name: Roger II DE MONTGOMERY
_AKA: Earl Of /Arundel/
NSFX: Earl of Arundel
Title: Earl of Arundel
Sex: M
Birth: Abt 1000 in Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England 1 2 3 4 5 6
Death: 27 JUL 1094 in , Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England 1 2 3 5 6
Burial: Abbey Of St Peter & St Paul, Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England 1 2 4 5 6
Ancestral File #: 9G84-H7
IDNO: HWS16971
LDS Baptism: 2 JAN 1970
Endowment: 27 JAN 1970 Temple: LANGE
_PRIMARY: Y
Sealing Child: status: Done
Sealing Child: status: Done
Event: Earl of Arundel , Arundel, Sussex, England 7 8 9 10
Event: Earl of Shrewsbury <, Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England> 7 8 9 10
Event: Viscount of Hiemois 8 9 10
Event: Regent of Normandy , , Normandie, France 8 9 10
Event: Regent of England , London, Middlesex, England 8 9 10
Event: Norman Conquest 14 OCT 1066 , Hastings, Sussex, England 11 9 10
Event: Church Calling , Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England 9 10
Note:
Was a Knight and companion for William the Conqueror in 1066 (Battle of Hastings was on 14 Oct 1066). His name found on the plaque in the Church at Dives-sur-Mer, Normandie, France, where William the Conqueror and his knights said mass before setting sail to invade England in 1066. This plaque lists all knights that took mart in the invasion.

Became a monk at Shrewsbury

Name Suffix: Earl of Arundel
Ancestral File Number: 9G84-H7

[Direct Linage1.FTW]

Note:
[Chancellor.FTW]
Roger De Montgomery II was in command of a wing at the Battle of Hastings, but returned to Normandy with Queen Matilda, and the young Duke Robert as Duke William's representative. He became head of the council that governed the Duchy of Normandy in Duke William's absence in England. The Norman Montgomery family ancestry was closely interwoven either by blood or marriage with the Duchy of Normandy. Roger De Montgomery had four sons. Eldest was Robert, Count of Alencon, and his successor in Normandy. He was followed by Hugh, who inherited the Earldom of Arundel, Chichester and Shrewsbury, the life custodian of the main family domains granted in England. These would eventually go to Robert in 1098, purchased from William Rufus for 3000 pounds. Next youngest was Count Roger De Poitou who was made the first Earl of Lancaster by Duke William of Normandy, a less maganamious grant which befitted the third youngest son. Philip, the youngest, remained in Normandy and accompanied Duke Robert on the first crusade to the Holy land, and died there in 1094[v38t0494.ftw]

Facts about this person:
Alt. Born 1022
[Direct Linage1.FTW]

After defeating Harold, William moved north and finished squashing any Saxon resistance through some fairly brutal methods. This having been done, he set about to consolidate his new kingdom. One thing which became quickly clear to him was that the geography of Wales was not conducive to an easy Norman victory. Understanding that he did not have the time or resources to subjugate Wales immediately, he decided to establish some of his more powerful men in large earldoms along the Welsh border. William fitz Osern was established as earl of Herfordshire in 1069; a castle was built at Chester and entrusted to Hugh of Avranches in 1070; in 1071, Roger of Montgomery was established in Shrewsbury. In each new earldom the earl was granted royal desmesne in the county and the control of the county town. In each case, the lands in the county were held in chief of the earl, not of the king. Each earl was given the licence, if not the command, to launch campaigns against the Welsh.
Roger of Montgomery was not idle. By 1070, he had consolidated his hold over Shrewsbury, and was ready to advance to the west beyong Offa's Dyke. First, he established the castle of Montgomery between the Dyke and the Severn. From Montgomery, Earl Roger moved along the river valley, establishing motte and baileys along the way. Asearly as 1073-4 they were able to cross the mountains and send expeditions into Ceredigion and Dyfed. By Roger's death in 1094, the prospects of full conquest in the center of Wales were very promising.
http://home.worldonline.dk/kmariboe/fgspwelsh.html

Most of the information contained in my files has been verified. However some information is "a best guess" opinion based on World Family Tree, Ancestry.com, Rootsweb and other sources. The information contained in my file may be used
Change Date: 24 JAN 2004 at 10:01:32

Father: Roger I DE MONTGOMERY b: Abt 970 in St. GErmain, Montgormerie, Normandie
Mother: Joscelina DE PONTAUDEMER b: 975 in France

Marriage 1 Mabel De Belleme TALVAS b: Abt 1005 in Alençon, Bell, Orne, France
Married: 1048 in of, , Perche, France  1 2 3 4 5 6
Sealing Spouse: 6 MAY 1970 in LANGE
Note: _UID92DAE93C977AFF4AB8BCE0BC24CB5847894A
Children
Sibyl DE MONTGOMERY b: 1052 in St Germain Mntgm, Normandy, France
Roger III DE MONTGOMERY b: 1058 in <, Montgomery, Montgomeryshire, Wales>
Arnulph DE MONTGOMERY b: Abt 1066 in Montgomery
Matilda DE MONTGOMERY b: Abt 1020 in , Montaigu, Maine-et-Loire, France
Ralph DE MONTGOMERY b: 1062

Sources:
1.     Repository:
Name: SLC - Family History Library
Salt Lake City, UT 84150 U.S.A.
25 N. West Temple Street
Salt Lake City, UT, 84150, U.S.A.
Title: "FamilySearch? Ancestral File™ v4.19"
Author: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Publication: (Created by FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service, 50 East North Temple Street, Salt Lake City, UT 84150, April 1, 1999)
Abbrev: Ancestral File™ v4.19 (FamilySearch?)

2.     Repository:
Name: Kirk Larson
Laguna Niguel, CA 92677 U.S.A.
23512 Belmar Dr.
Laguna Niguel, CA, 92677, U.S.A.    
Title: "Genealogical Research of Kirk Larson"
Author: Larson, Kirk
Publication: Personal Research Works including Bethune & Hohenlohe Descendants, 1981-2001, Kirk Larson, Private Library
Abbrev: Larson: Genealogical Research of Kirk Larson

3.     Title: 1827427.ged
Abbrev: 1827427.ged
Note:
Source Media Type: Other
Text: Date of Import: Apr 9, 2002

3.     Title: Direct Linage1.FTW
Abbrev: Direct Linage1.FTW
Note:
Source Media Type: Other
Text: Date of Import: Jul 1, 2002

3.     Title: Sergent.ged
Abbrev: Sergent.ged
Note:
Source Media Type: Other
Text: Date of Import: Nov 24, 2002

6.     Title: Sergent2.ged
Abbrev: Sergent2.ged
Note:
Source Media Type: Other
Text: Date of Import: Feb 16, 2003

7.     Repository:
Name: Kirk Larson
Laguna Niguel, CA 92677 U.S.A.
23512 Belmar Dr.
Laguna Niguel, CA, 92677, U.S.A.
Title: "Heraldry Coat of Arms"
Author: Elliott, J. M.
Publication: (http://www.onlinepub.net/arms/arms.html, Online Publishing, May 12, 1999) Attn: Heraldry Dept., 13124 E. Nixon Ave, Spokane, Washington 99216, 509-924-4429, FAX: 509-924-4616
Abbrev: European Heraldry #1 Coat of Arms by J. M. Elliott
Note:
"Armigerous" (ahr-MIJ-ehr-us) adjective
Bearing or entitled to bear heraldic arms.
The reason the notion of a family crest was brought into the language was that those who were armigerous (entitled to bear arms) used to put their crest or achievement (the full coat of arms) on their carriage, silver, etc. The stationers thought this an excellent way to sell more stationary and, in Victorian times, encouraged everybody, whether armigerous or not, to buy stationary with their "family crest" on it. There was no such thing of course and they used to sell it (and some still do) on the basis that "someone in your family or someone having the same surname as you was once granted this crest - as part of their achievement. Thereby they sold more stationery. And engravers flourished. The Heralds, meanwhile, lost a bit of business as their services (awarding coats with variations because no two people can have the same coat) were less sought after.
Text: Copyright ? 1997-98-99 J.M. Elliott & On-Line-Publishing. All rights reserved.
Repository:

8.     Name: Arnaud Bunel
Title: "Héraldique européenne"
Author: Arnaud Bunel
Publication: Coats of Arms for European Royalty and Nobility (http://www.heraldique-europeenne.org, Arnaud Bunel, 1998) , Internet
Abbrev: European Heraldry #2 Crests by Arnaud Bunel
Note:
"Armigerous" (ahr-MIJ-ehr-us) adjective
Bearing or entitled to bear heraldic arms.
The reason the notion of a family crest was brought into the language was that those who were armigerous (entitled to bear arms) used to put their crest or achievement (the full coat of arms) on their carriage, silver, etc. The stationers thought this an excellent way to sell more stationary and, in Victorian times, encouraged everybody, whether armigerous or not, to buy stationary with their "family crest" on it. There was no such thing of course and they used to sell it (and some still do) on the basis that "someone in your family or someone having the same surname as you was once granted this crest - as part of their achievement. Thereby they sold more stationery. And engravers flourished. The Heralds, meanwhile, lost a bit of business as their services (awarding coats with variations because no two people can have the same coat) were less sought after.
The Shields used are family Logos, each individual with armigerous rights had individual full coats of arms to reflect their personal achievements.

9.     Repository:
Name: SLC - Family History Library
Salt Lake City, UT 84150 U.S.A.
25 N. West Temple Street
Salt Lake City, UT, 84150, U.S.A.
Call Number: 929/.2/0973 ED: 20
Title: "Royal ancestors of some American families"
Author: Call, Michel L.
Publication: (Salt Lake City (P.O. Box 11488, Salt Lake City, Utah 84147) : M.L. Call, c1989.), LC CALL NO.: CS55.C351989; LCCN: 89-188438 //r92
Abbrev: Royal Ancestors of Some American Families (Michel L. Call)
Text: DESCRIPTION: 1 v. (unpaged) ; 29 cm.
NOTES: "August 1989"--Verso t.p. Includes bibliographical references.
SUBJECTS: Families of royal descent. United States--Genealogy.
Page: #409
Quality: 3

10.     Repository:
Name: Kirk Larson
Laguna Niguel, CA 92677 U.S.A.
23512 Belmar Dr.
Laguna Niguel, CA, 92677, U.S.A.
Title: "Genealogical Research of Kirk Larson"
Author: Larson, Kirk
Publication: Personal Research Works including Bethune & Hohenlohe Descendants, 1981-2001, Kirk Larson, Private Library
Abbrev: Larson: Genealogical Research of Kirk Larson
Quality: 3

11.     Repository:
Name: Kirk Larson
Laguna Niguel, CA 92677 U.S.A.
23512 Belmar Dr.
Laguna Niguel, CA, 92677, U.S.A.
Title: "List of Knights with William the Conqueror, 1066"
Author: Schulze, Lorine McGinnis
Publication: List of Medival Knights with William the Conqueror, (ote@@rootsbed.com, The Olive Tree Genealogy Web Site, Olive Tree Enterprises, 14 Sep 1996)
Abbrev: William the Conqueror, List of Knights with 1066 (Lorine McGinnis Schulze)
Note:
For hundreds of years before 1066, England had been ruled by Anglo-Saxon
kings. When Edward "the Confessor" died in 1066, William of Normandy saw his chance for a successful invation of England. He built a fleet, attracted many knights, and obtained the pope's blessing. He gained victory at the Battle of Hastings and was crowned King of England on Christmas of 1066. During the next few years, William presided over a gradual redistribution of land in England. Saxon rebellions led to the confiscation of lands, which the Norman Barons received. As a result of this Norman invation, the English
people today are of both Norman and Anglo-Saxon extraction.
Text: William the Conqueror (Battle of Hastings was fought on 14 Oct 1066). His name found on the plaque in the Church at Dives-sur-Mer, Normandy, France, where he and his knights said mass (and he was christened) before setting sail to invade England. This plaque lists all knights that took mart in the invasion.



[daveanthes.FTW]
_MED Book
ABBR Royalty for Commoners
TITL Royalty for Commoners: The Complete Known Lineage of John  of Gaunt, Son of Edward III, King of England, and Queen Philippa
AUTH Roderick W. Stuart
PUBL 3rd ed., 1998, Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.,  Baltimore, MD
DATE 20 JUL 1999

OCCU Earl of Montgomery ...
SOUR misc.traveller.com/genealogy/gedhtml/kmilburn;
HAWKINS.GED says CIR 1005; gendex.com/users/daver/rigney says 1022 and place;
Royalty for Commoners, Roderick W. Stuart, p. 238 says c1005;
SOUR HAWKINS.GED;
Royalty for Commoners, Roderick W. Stuart, p. 238 says 27 Jul 1094;
COMYNI.GED (Compuserve) says ABT 27 Jul 1094;
SOUR gendex.com/users/daver/rigney/D0001
Roger de Montgomeri - COMYN4.TAF (Compuserve), p. 23; Earl of Shrewsbury,
Earl of Arundel, Regent of Normandie - COMYNI.GED (Compuserve);Roger II of
Montgomery (later earl of Shrewsbury), supporter of William the Conqueror -
The Norman Conquest, C.T. Chevallier, p.55;The Franco-Flemish division, esti-
mated strength 1,600, under Roger...,2nd in the column [at the Battle of Hast-
ings] - p. 104;E. of Chichester-Royalty for Commoners, Roderick W. Stuart,p137
ROGER DE MONTGOMERY, son of ROGER DE MONTGOMERI and JOSCELINE. was Seigneur de Montgomery, Vicomte of Hiemois; Earl of Arundel and Shrewsbury; Regent of Normandy and England - Royalty for Commoners, Roderick W. Stuart, p. 237
Scott and Brian show two different dates. Scott shows he died 1123. I am not 100% sure this is the correct line. But it does point to this based on the dates etc. Royal Ancestors of some American Families by Michel Call SLC 1989 #409 -
http://gendex.com/users/daver/rigney/D0001/G0000066.html#I742

TITL Final.ged
REPO
CALN
MEDI Other
DATA
TEXT Date of Import: Feb 1, 1999
Earl of Shrewsbury and Arundel
OCCU Earl of Shropshire & Shrewsbury; Earl of Arundel
EDUC Vicomte of Heimois,sire of Alenconubject:Re: Roger de MontgomeryFrom:Jim Stevens <jstevens@@IQUEST.NET>Date:Sun, 6 Apr 1997 21:43:06 -0500>Dear Jim,>        I was reading a post of yours on Roger de Montgomery(answer to Jay>Garner 11/25/96) and the dates rang a bell. I have Roger deBeaumont, b.>about 1022 in Normandy, d. 1094. He was Seigneur ofPort-Audemer. He was>said to have governed Normandy while William was off inEngland. He married>Adeline de Meullent about 1040. This information came from theMary & John>series (source of one of Gordon Fisher's posts, also).> I'm no scholar - most of my education at the moment is coming from>this list since I don't have easy access to the books mentioned(although>I'm improving my library as the pocketbook allows). But I was struck by the>similarities between Roger de Beaumont and Roger de Montgomery.Can you>straighten me out????>  I also enjoyed your posts on Thomas of Savoy althoughI'm hopelessly>lost in Burgundy! My relationships to these people are probablyshaky, but>fun! You don't happen to have any du Bois (they connect with deFiennes) or>de Forests, do you? I'm on solid ground with them.>>Becky Kenton Pyle  (becky@@4you.net)> 541 Bloomfield Ave.; Urbana, Champaign Co., OH  43078 Becky, thanks for the kind words.  As far as I can tell theBeaumont andMontgomery families were not related.  I will share with you mynotes on the two Rogers: Roger de Montgomery: 1st Earl of Arundel and Shrewsbury.  His wife, MABEL, broughthim theLordship af Alcenon in Normandy.  When WILLIAM THE CONQUERER invaded England in 1066, Roger remained in Normandy as regent. He joined WILLIAMin England in 1067 and was created Earl of Arundel.  Upon thedismembermentof Mercia in 1070, he was also given land in the Welsh Marchesand became Earl of Shrewsbury. Roger de Beaumont:Weis" "Ancestral Roots. . ." (50:24)."ROGER DE BEAUMONT, SIRE DE PONTEAUDEMER, born about 1010,succeeded to thefamily estates in Normandy, as Sire du Ponteaudemer, Seigneur deVeulles,Pre'aux, Torville, and du Ponteaitorf, and Seigneur de Beaumont(orBellomont), by which last name he came to be generally described.  By his marriage he greatly increased the possessions and prestige ofthe family,and he rose to be one of the most powerful feudal noblemen ofhis age inNormandy.  When William the Conqueror invaded England in 1066,Roger deBeaumont furnished sixty armed vessels for the fleet and wasleft in chargeof the government of Normandy when the Conqueror started on theexpedition. He munificently endowed the Abbey of Pre'aux, of which late inlife hebecame a monk; and dying in 1094 at advanced age, he was buriedin thismonastery at Ponteaudemer, Normandy."--- J Gardner Bartlett, *Newberry Genealogy*, Boston, 1914, p4-5.
Roger's two sons, Robert and Henry, both accompanied DukeWilliam when he invaded England and both recieved vast estates and titles. As you observe, the two men had remarkably similiar careers andsurely must have worked closely together while Duke William was in England. I wish I could clarify each of their roles as "regent" and as "being incharge ofthe government" of Normandy, but I can't. I am sending a copy of this post to GEN-MEDIEVAL in the hopes that someone can further eloborate.Today is the first day of the rest of your life !(jstevens@@iquest.net)
JimSubject:Re: Roger de Montgomery/Roger de BeaumontFrom:ntaylor@@fas.harvard.edu (Nathaniel Taylor)Date:Mon, 07 Apr 1997 00:11:22 -0500To Jim Stevens' account of these two men I would only add that they and their posterities can be found in Schwennicke's ES 3:637-41(Montgomery)and 3:700,702-4 (Beaumont).  Both are mentioned extensively inDavid C.Douglas' excellent biography of _William the Conqueror_(Berkeley, 1964)and will no doubt also be found in the _Complete Peerage_ underShrewsbury(Montgomery) and Leicester (Beaumont).Nat Taylor
DATE 13 MAR 1999

DATE 27 APR 2000

GIVN Roger De
SURN MONTGOMERY
AFN 9G84-H7
REPO @@REPO1097@@
TITL Ancestral File (R)
AUTH The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
PUBL Copyright (c) 1987, June 1998, data as of 5 January 1998
ABBR Ancestral File (R)
_MASTER Y

DATE 8 OCT 2000
TIME 16:43:54

GIVN Roger De
SURN MONTGOMERY
AFN 9G84-H7
REPO @@REPO1097@@
TITL Ancestral File (R)
AUTH The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
PUBL Copyright (c) 1987, June 1998, data as of 5 January 1998
ABBR Ancestral File (R)
_MASTER Y

DATE 8 OCT 2000
TIME 16:43:54