General Notes

[Joanne's Tree.1 GED.GED]

2  SOUR S332582
3  DATA
4  TEXT Date of Import: 14 Jan 2004


[daveanthes.FTW]

TYPE Book
AUTH Å or c:Weis, Frederick Lewis
PERI Ancestral Roots
EDTN 7th
PUBL Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., Baltimore, MD (1999)
TEXT (141-16)
TYPE Book
AUTH Stuart, Roderick W.
PERI Royalty for Commoners
EDTN 3d
PUBL Genealogical Publishing co., Inc, Baltimore, MD (1998)
ISB 0-8063-1561-X
TEXT 301-39
DATE 23 MAY 2000

OCCU Billung
SOUR HAWKINS.GED
SOUR HAWKINS.GED

RELI Sources: O'shea/Charlemagne  qvcubject:Re: Ottonian descent from Charlemagne From:ntaylor@@fas.harvard.edu (Nathaniel  Taylor)Date:Mon, 28 Apr 1997 22:34:04 -0500 In article <33646CE8.1659@@hotmail.com>, mat_man@@hotmail.comwrote:> I came across this descent when I was looking up> Henry the Fowler's ancestry, in an article by E. Hlawitschka> in Rheinisch Vierteljahrblatter, 1974, p128 which I'vealready> quoted. I wonder if this descent has been accepted by the more> recent genealogical compendiums (eg. Settipani). <snip>> Charlemagne>          _____________|_____________________>         | |> Pippin IV d.810                   Louis the Pious>         |
      |>      Aeda-Attala m. Billung            Louis the German> b.806 |                         |>                  | |>                 Oda m. Ludolf
  |>                d.913|    d.866             |> _____|__________ |>               |                | |>            Otto Luitgarde m. Louis II d.882>
           d.912The Hlawitschka article, "Zur Herkunft der Liudolfinger und zueinigenCorbeyer Geschichtsquellen," Rheinische Vierteljahrsblatter 98(1974),92-165, is also reprinted in his _Stirps
regia: Forschungen zuKnigtumund Fhrungsschichten im frheren Mittelalter_ (Frankfort amMain, 1988).This Carolingian-Ottonian link does not appear in Settipani's_Prehistoiredes Capetiens_ (nor in Werner's 'Nachkommen Karls des Grossen',publishedbefore Hlawitschka's article).  Pippin's five daughters are allnoted asdead ends in both works.  The Hlawitschka article is cited bySettipani in a footnote in his entry for Louis III (your 'Louis II' above),p. 655, n.288; he says Hlawitschka should be consulted for the Liudolfing family, with the addition of Brigitte Kasten, _Adalhard von Corbie: dieBiographieeines karolingischen Politikers und Klostervorstehers_(Dsseldorf,1986), 176-207; and Winfrid Glocker, _Die Verwandten der Ottonenund ihreBedeutung in der Politik: Studien zur Familienpolitik und zurGenealogiedes sachsischen Kaiserhauses_ (Kln, 1989).  I will look forthese to seeif either explicitly refutes Hlawitschka; otherwise, I don'tknow whySettipani would have ignored it in his notice of the daughtersof Pippinof Italy (211-12).  It has been assumed by historians that the Ottonians had no Carolingianblood at all in the early generations, so this would constitutea serioushistorical revision.  Has anyone found a discussion of this inrecenthistories or other genealogical compendia?  Nat Taylor
DATE 2 JAN 1999